The Vegetational Fatherhood

I was inclined to compare this story to a lot of what is in Ovid's Metamorphoses. My experience with these stories comes mainly from an art historical perspective rather than a classical one, but from what I have gathered from hours spent looking at slides of Rococo ceiling frescoes is that many of these stories were about the "Loves of the Gods," which basically amounts to divine beings seducing humans by transforming into something else (see: Leda and the Swan, Europa and the Bull, etc.) or else human (or humanlike) beings turning into nonhuman things to escape a horrible fate (Apollo and Daphne). These are to be taken metaphorically, as in a lot of cases these myths are used to explain natural phenomena (read up on the birth of Venus and where she came from...)

In this vein, then, the story is less of a stretch. However, at the beginning of this course we did establish the difference between fairy tales and myths, that they serve different purposes and arise from different traditions. That being said, this story comes from an author with access to both traditions, and there is no reason why one shouldn't inform the other--it makes for a richer story.

I think this story draws both from the metaphorical aspects of the classical myth and the dark, euphemistic traditions of the traditional fairy tale. The idea of a rose seducing a woman seems strongly Ovidian, while the expansion on the idea makes it seem more of a literary fairy tale (showing the mother and daughter in scene, developing their relationship, while still maintaining elements of the fantastic.)

Interpretation of The Vegetational Fatherhood

This story was interesting in that it contained certain elements of a fairy tale, however, it seemed to work in reverse. The main idea this pertains to is the element of transformation. This transformation was not a curse or anything, but rather a willing occurrence. Also, the transformation did not end and ultimately led to the death of the young girl. It seems that in other tales read, the transformation ended after the hero solved the problem. In the Juniper Tree for example, once the stepmother was killed, the little boy was no longer a bird. In the Donkeyskin stories, the transformations protected the girls from harm. In the story The Seven Ravens, after the sister completed her quest, her brothers were restored. There are many examples of instances like these. Upon reading The Vegetational Fatherhood, this reversal of the element of transformation seems to characterize the story as a different take on fairy tales. It shares a very common aspect, but reverses "the norm."

The Vegetational Fatherhood

This story had some fairy tale elements like taking place in a non-specific time and place, and of course the transformation of the daughter into a rose during her nightly prayer.

But just reading through the story, the tone seemed very scientific (delving into the possibility that humans are linked with plants) and there was no element of magic in characters outside the mother, the father rose, the daughter, and Dr. Rosenberger - The outside world seems to be completely logical and magic-free as the mother and Dr. Rosenberger are put in an insane asylum when they suggest that the daughter transformed into a rose bush.

In the story, the mother and Dr. Rosenberger are seen as crazy when in fact they are the only ones that know the truth. Even when the daughter's autopsy showed clear signs that she was part plant, this fact was cast away as a science experiment Dr. Rosenberger had conducted. Maybe the point of this story is to question whether what we know as true is actually true or if it is just society's way of maintaining control over anything beyond the norm...

The Vegetational Fatherhood

This story was extremely interesting to try to interpret.  We start off with a woman lying in a field, and a rose looking at her seductively.  The woman then falls asleep, while the rose moves closer.  After this point, it is mostly up to interpretation over whether the rose did anything, transformed into anything, or was even there. This interpretation can be added onto with the sudden pregnancy of the woman.  From here, we go on with a natural story.  Until the daughter that the woman had begins to transform into a rose, transformation being an element seen in many fairy tales.  This is where this story begins to take on an element of fairy tales.  The rest of the story is exceedingly un-magical, with the exception of the daughter turning into a rose, but this has come to be ordinary to the reader.  

I found there to be no direct interpretation of this story.  It seems to be a fairy tale, but only through limited elements such as transformation.  Everything else was very straight-forward story like. 

Assignment 10 - 7. April 2009

Hi Nikki, Benton, Michelle, Emily, Erin and Tiffany,

For this week, read the tale The Vegetational Fatherhood and try to interpret this tale.

You could talk about the idea behind the story, the characters, the fact that it does/does not fit into the catagory ,,Kunstmärchen", the message it wants to convey/fails to, or about anything other thing that catches your attention...there are no specific expectations...you can work with this tale any way you want.

Looking forward to your posts!

Ann

Wondrous Oriental Tale

A Wondrous Oriental Tale of a Naked Saint definitely fits into the Fairy Tale genre because of its amorphous time and place, "The Orient... the wilderness of this region" (Wackenroder), "This lasted for many years, day and night" (Wackenroder). There is also the typical fairy tale characteristic of a conflict being resolved. Though this tale is definitely does not end like a Disney version of "happily ever after," there is still the element of a happy ending as the naked saint is freed from his affliction/torture.

When reading this fairy tale, the music builds and builds, "ethereal music flowed... sweet horns and countless magical instruments" until finally a song "arose from the undulating music" (Wackenroder). It is almost as if the poem/song is the climax of the saint's musical experience, and in this sense, the relationship between music and poetic language is that the music makes the poetic language exponentially more powerful and effective.

This story fell into the Kunstmarchen category most definitely because it was distinctly more literary than its folkish counterparts. The specificity of setting especially indicates that the depth of storytelling involved is much more substantial than with a traditional tale--it is not just set in a "kingdom far away." However, the presence of the supernatural and bigger than life occurances firmly root this story in the fairy tale tradition.

The transformative quality of music in this story speaks to the transcendent attributes it has in the real world--it is quite literally the universal language, understood by all nationalities and able to transport a listener to a place outside everyday experience. The same is true for poetry, to an extent, with the obvious linguistic present for poetry but not music.

it is a fairy tale: it has elements of transformation, and is unknown location and time.  Also, music.  Music is the art that all humans experience.  there is no time frame.

I beleive that music and language are intertwined, that music can evoke language, and vice versa.  Writing triggers more specific thoughts and ideas though.  Music is all-encompassing.

A Wondrous Oriental Tale...

     This tale fits into the genre of the fairy tale because of its similar elements.  For one, it takes place in an unidentified time.  There is no time period where this fits into, and no precise time period that we can associate it with.  It is also in an unidentified place.  "...frequently found in the wilderness of this region." (Wackenroder)  While it says, "this region" it is never specified what "this region" is.  Another element similar to the fairy tale is the magic element.  Indescribable things are happening, hence the spinning wheel, but they are unexplainable.  The magic spell at the end also fits into the genre of the fairy tale, as it is broken.

     I think the music works with the poetic language.  It is language in itself, and is the element of the tale that breaks the spell the saint has been under.  I think the flow of the poetry itself, even if it was not specified as music, would be enough language to work in this story.

Assignment 9 - 31. March 2009

Hi Benton, Nikki, Emily, Erin, Michelle and Tiffany,

Here is this week's assignment. Please take note of the deadlines.

Read Wackenroder's A Wondrous Oriental Tale of a Naked Saint and do the following:

1. Using elements from this tale, explain how it fits into the Fairy Tale/Kunstmärchen genre.

2. Trace the relationship of music and poetic language. Is the power evoked by music also accessible to language or does language merely point out to music and/or what music does.

Deadline for posts: 10.00 a.m. on Wednesday

Deadline for comments on a minimum of two posts: Midnight on Wednesday


Looking forward to your posts!

Ann

Posts in, on time..great going!

Heroine's Character

In the Grimms' "The Robber Bridegroom," the heroine is presented as a clever girl concerned with self-preservation. She makes sure to have a way back (using the peas and lentils to guide her), collects evidence to prove her accusations, and trusts her instincts. A clear example of her natural cleverness is the fact that her gut instincts told her she was being led into harm's way. For example, "when sunday came and the girl was supposed to leave, she became dreadfully frightened without knowing why." Because of this feeling, she made precautions so that she could get home.

Elements of Horror

The Bluebeard stories are unlike others we have read so far. This is mainly because of the degree of violence represented. In the stories, there is a chamber of some kind of dead, bloody maidens. In "The Robber Bridegroom" and "Mr. Fox" a hand or finger is cut off out of greed. These stories contain murder, greed, cannibalism and other unpleasant deeds. They seem to be very strict warnings rather than other more subtle insinuations.

Treatment of the Heroine

Bluebeard is not the first fairy tale in which we've seen a heroine who is cunning and active in her own right (see: some versions of Little Red Riding Hood and Hansel and Gretel) However, this is the first that I can recall where the heroine is introduced outright as being intelligent, in addition to being beautiful. She is everything that Snow White is not; rather than being the silent, still girl in a glass display case, she has agency and makes decisions--and pays dearly for it.

"He no longer had power over her, and had to do her bidding," write the Brothers Grimm in Fitcher's Bird, exemplifying the heroine's intelligence as her means of escaping trouble on her own.

"She was terrified that she might wake one of them up, but God guided her footsteps," they write in the Robber Bridegroom, attributing even divine protection on their heroine, a far cry from shaming her for disobedience.

I don't think that this story is meant to demonize curiosity in women, as the Perrault moral (in rhyme, no less, so it's easy to remember/needlepoint onto a pillow!) dictates. If this were really a story whose moral seeks to discourage women from disobeying their husbands, the heroine would have died. End of story. Bluebeard is the one who pays in the end, stabbed to death by the heroine's brothers and relatives, his end brought about by the very woman who ignored the arbitrary demands he would not even be around to enforce. Her curiosity could even be considered a good thing--she found the chamber and set about a series of events that brought a serial killer to justice! Great justification for snooping! The Perrault version of Bluebeard is the only story in the cluster than even takes this stance--all the rest praise the heroine's cunning and condemn Bluebeard's abhorrent deeds. Fitcher's Bird, the Robber Bridegroom, and Mr. Fox all present a resolution contigent on the heroine's cunning ploy to trap the villain, rather than punish her for sticking her nose where she ought not.

Elements of Horror

In the stories of Bluebeard, the horrific secret hidden behind the door in each respective telling of the tale seems to address the question, "What is absolutely the most nauseating, terrifying thing the disobedient wife could find behind the door to the forbidden room?" That Bluebeard is a serial killer seems to be of less consequence than the young wife's indiscretion--he did specifically tell her not to open the door, didn't he? The horror in this story is not standalone. Bluebeard is not the terrifying tale of a mad murderer--it centers on the girl's bizarre experience in relation to Bluebeard, and how the horrors were brought on by her curiosity, defiance, agency, etc.

While the horror trope is basically the same in all the stories (horrific death of innocent girl witnessed by the heroine), where the stories differ is in the attitude the narratorial voice has toward what the girl sees. The Perrault version treats the chamber as something terrifying in and of itself. In the Grimm version (Fitcher's Bird), the bloody chamber and the murders of the heroine's sisters serve as more of a challenge for the third sister to overcome. And in the Jacobs version, the narrator is somewhat cavalier about the girl's macarbe discovery, as though she had just stumbled upon Mr. Fox's unsettling collection of Scientology literature rather than the mangled corpses of his victims.

We've talked a lot in this course about the tones of these stories as interpreted by at 21st century audience likely indoctrinated from the crib with the Disneyfied versions of fairy tales. The intermingling of horror and fantasy in the literary versions of fairy tales is a little bit jarring at first, and in this series of stories, we are seeing it from a different perspective: that horror in literature has a place other than blood and guts for the sake of blood and guts.

Presentation of the heroine

In Mr. Fox, by Joseph Jacobs, the heroine, Lady Mary was portrayed more as a celebration of self-preservation and cleverness.  She knew that something was up with Mr. Fox's house, so she took the initiative to go and check it out.  "But Lady Mary was a brave one, she was, and she opened the door, and what do you think she saw? Why, bodies and skeletons of beautiful young ladies all stained with blood.  So Lady Mary thought it was high time to get out of that horrid place..." (Tatar 154).  Lady Mary, in contrast with other stories, was not told to stay away from the house, or any particular room, in which case she prevents herself as being presented as disobedient.  Instead of being scared, she also is bold and tells what she saw- and Mr. Fox gets killed.

Elements of Horror

There were many different elements of horror in the versions of Bluebeard that I read for today.  One element is that of physical horror.  In many of the versions there were fingers chopped off, heads chopped off, murder, and cut pieces of bodies.  There was also blood everywhere.  Another element of horror notified was that of the setting.  In many of the versions, the house was in the dark woods, it was a sinister house, and a place where the girls just did not feel comfortable.  Another element was that of the girls.  IN each story, there were beautiful girls talked about, and eventually killed.  These function in the story because they allow the plot to be described and be intriguing.  They move it along, in a way that you just need to know what happens because of the horrible aspects.  It might startle the audience, but it is in a way that makes this story stand out in your mind.

the horror

An element of horror is the concept of loss of female virginity.  The bloody key is a motif that runs through the different versions of this concept.  Linked with loss of female virginity is marital disobedience-- the fear of the husband [or robber] that the woman is going to somehow betray him.  that is why Bluebeard-- or the robbers- or the similar characters-- do not seem to trust their wives, and always manage to "catch" her in her lies.  Further linked with loss of female virginity is the notion of any kind of "transgressive desire" in respects to the female character.  She is supposed to stay in line, and if she strays, then she is always caught and "taught her lesson."

Another element of horror is the sheer psychotic rage on Bluebeard's character.  He seems utterly emotionless, or, as Tatar says, "abject" to his acts of murder.  He is absolutely heartless.  It makes him unhuman.

Overall, all the Bluebeard tales taint marriage with its threat of murder.  The Bluebeard tales make it out to seem like you can never get too comfortable with your husband or wife, because you can never trust someone when it comes right down to it.  Bluebeard, as Tatar puts it, "confirms a child's worst fears about sex."  With marriage or sex comes betrayal and murder, in the Bluebeard tales, and is rendered in elements in the tales such as the characters' anxieties.  In "Bluebeard's Ghost" Sly's nephew commits the ultimate betrayal, even though he is not married to Bluebeard's widow, he is the potential suitor, so the theme of elements of horror applies to him.  The concept of him dressing-up as a deceased man-- Bluebeard-- and tricking people based on that-- proves how sick and twisted his mind is, to an extent that is more than creepy to the reader.  The nightmares and anxiety that Bluebeard's widow has because of the whole situation augments the horror of the "trickery."

Bluebeard's Daughter

In "Bluebeard's Daughter," Djamileh is presented as clever, but in the sense that she is clever in "playing the game" of accepting the limitations that are placed on females, and maneuvering herself within the context of those limitations.  She does not step outside the boundaries of conventional femininity: she remains docile and subservient to her husband Kayel, in the sense that she does not "act-out," but instead, acts more passively, as a typical female should, not letting on how much she knows, or what her true intentions sometimes are.  For example, she hides the blood-stained key from him, and keeps it with her at all times, hidden.  She plays dumb with him.  She does not flaunt any knowledge she may have.  When she is told that curiosity is not good for her, how she should not have an education, she accepts it on the outside, and seems to convince herself to accept it, even though the idea of being unfulfilled by not being educated is troubling to her.  

It bothered me how the author seemed to play-into these gender notions, making statements in the narration such as "Djamileh, who was better educated than her husband in such useless studies as calligraphy, examined the parchment and read aloud: 'curiosity killed the cat.'"  She idealizes only her skills in frivolous activities like calligraphy.  I do not know whether to interpret the narrator's statements as being in a mocking tone or actually stemming from legitimate feelings and thoughts.  Kayel is consistently referred to as "master of the house," and for taking actions and being aggressive, in the conventional male way.  However, he is also labeled as "soft-hearted," making him the perfect, well-rounded male. It was common for men to be framed in a positive light in fairy tales-- or, at least, the "prince" characters: displaying manly qualities, yet also the perfect slight amount of sensitivity and nurturing.  But when Kayel expresses his wish to divorce her, Djamileh grows quite pathetic for a temporary amount of time, and becomes emotional and weak, crying to the old woman, or, "bursting into tears."  But, surprinsgly, the author turns the plot, and has Djamileh emerge quite strong, as she devises a plan for how to escape her situation.  It is as if, the author agrees that when it comes down to it, in a crunch, a woman has the ability to draw on all of her resources to escape.  "And Djamieleh, listening with closed eyes, debated within herself why Kayel should be so cross. ...." Clearly, Djamielh considers how she ought to be treated, how deserving she truly is of someone caring, and therefore takes Kayel off of his pedestal.

Bluebeard - heroine's character

Question 2: Tatar offers two readings of the heroine's character: either as a celebration of self-preservation and cleverness or as a disobedient female. Using a version other than the Perrault, consider how the heroine gets presented. Use quotes to support your reading.

In Grimms' The Robber Bridegroom, the heroine (the young girl) is initially portrayed as a clever girl as she "filled both her pockets with peas and lentils to mark the way" (151). But then she is portrayed as a disobedient female as she keeps ignoring the caged bird's warnings to "turn back, turn back..." (152). But after the witch helps the young girl escape, the girl is again portrayed as a clever girl while she re-tells the story of how her bridegroom is actually a murderer and how she had the thought to save the finger with the ring as some sort of evidence of her story.

On a sidenote, I also see the witch in this story as a heroine. Her character is definitely a celebration of a female who uses her intelligence for self-preservation. The witch successfully keeps the murderers from discovering the young girl, and the witch also helps the girl escape back to her castle.

Bluebeard - elements of horror

Question 1: Compare the elements of horror in the various versions of Bluebeard that you read for today. Please name the elements you are comparing and discuss how they function in the story. Do they help move the plot along? Elaborate the story? Startle the audience? etc.

In man versions of Bluebeard like Perrault's Bluebeard, Grimm's Fitcher's Bird, and Jacob's Mr. Fox, the main element of horror was the small (forbidden) room with all the dead, chopped up bodies of young women. In these versions, the wife is told not to enter this room under any circumstances, but the wife can't resist and enters the room just to see all the dead bodies. The description of this room is pretty horrific with descriptions of bloody chopped up fragments of bodies. In Grimm's The Robber Bridegroom, the young maiden actually witnesses the killing and consumption of another young girl.

This element of physical horror functions as some sort of punishment for those who dare to disobey the master of the house. It also functions as a way for readers to realize the true horrific nature of Bluebeard/sorcerer/robber.

Another less-obvious element of horror in many of the versions of Bluebeard is the reaction and emotion of the young girl/wife when she realizes she cannot wipe the blood off of the key/egg. This element of horror functions to allow readers to feel the fear and desperation of the young girl as she tries, to no avail, to somehow undo what she knows was wrong in the first place. This illustration of the girl's emotions serves to create a sort of nervous suspense of what Bluebeard is going to do to his wife when he finds out that she disobeyed him.

Assignment 8 - 24. March 2009

Hi Nikki, Erin, Emily, Benton, Michelle and Tiffany,

For this week, please complete two separate posts.

Question 1: Compare the elements of horror in the various versions of Bluebeard that you read for today. Please name the elements you are comparing and discuss how they function in the story. Do they help move the plot along? Elaborate the story? Startle the audience? etc.

Question 2: Tatar offers two readings of the heroine's character: either as a celebration of self-preservation and cleverness or as a disobedient female. Using a version other than the Perrault, consider how the heroine gets presented. Use quotes to support your reading.


DEADLINE for Posts: Midnight on Tuesday

DEADLINE for Comments on atleast two other posts: Midnight on Wednesday

Again, please post two separate entries!

Ann

The Devil's Three Golden Hairs

I definitely think the target audience of this film was the younger, lower/middle class because of the emphasis on hard work (as with the DEFA Snow White film) as well as the element of comedy present in the film.

I found many similarities between "The Devil's Three Golden Hairs" and "Snow White" - the most obvious similarity to me was in the opening scene. "The Devil's Three Golden Hairs" opens with the blacksmiths working really hard, and in "Schneewittchen," the kitchen scene with all the cooks and kitchen hands working away. Both of these scenes were really long (even though they really didn't contribute that much to the actual plot of the story) and were meant to emphasize the benefits of hard work.

This "lesson" of hard work that the film attempts to teach makes me believe even more that the film was geared towards the younger population (possibly towards children)

Devil with the three golden hairs

     I would say that this audience might be lower to middle class, and younger rather than adults.  It is created in such a way to preserve teachings, and not be able to interpret it in any other way than just a story.  

     This movie is similar in a way to the version of Snow White that we saw, because of its humanization of certain elements.  In Snow White, instead of the "magical" element of the mirror, we got a clever machine.  In this movie, the devil is very human looking.  There is not necessarily an aspect of "devilish" nature, like I would necessarily expect.  While the devil does have horns and a tail, they are very minimal in terms of the whole.  His magic is also overdone, and could be explained by special effects.  

     I found the medium of this film to be told in a very humorous way, especially the part with the boy taking care of the devil.  There is no devil's grandmother as in the Grimms novel.  Instead, the boy is left handling things himself.  He watches the devil play piano, combs out his hair, makes him dinner...I interpreted this part of the plot as an additional way to make the concept of this movie ridiculous, and fake.  This society didn't want to acknowledge that there was magic, or stories other then the ones they were telling.  

The Devil w/ 3 Golden Hairs

The intended audience of this film seems to be the middle class who could potentially identify with the working class of the movie. This is identifiable as a DEFA production because, as in Snow White, the film seems to involve a slapstick element even though it is acting as propaganda of East Germany. The medium is an advantage to the propaganda effort because not much is let up to the imagination, so whatever image the DEFA wants to portray is seen by the audience.

Assignment 7 - 17.March 2009

Hi Nikki, Tiffany, Erin, Benton, Emily and Michelle,

Here's the assignment for this week. Please note that the deadlines are different from the usual.


After having viewed the DEFA film "The Devil's Three Golden Hairs", do the following:

1. Try to interpret from the movie, who the target audience might be. Keep in mind, that the film was made in 1977 in East Germany.

2. Compare the movie with the DEFA version of Snow White.

3. Explain how the medium 'film' is used to tell the story. You could consider talking about the plot, dialogue, etc.

Do try to touch upon all three points in your blog.

Deadline for posts: 11.00 a.m. on Wednesday

Deadline for comments on at least two posts: Midnight on Wednesday

Looking forward to your posts!

Ann

Beauty and the Beast

Something that I thought that was interesting in both versions was the fact that the story seemed to share elements with many different fairy tales. For example, the fact that there were three sisters, two of whom were "evil," seemed similar to Cinderella. The mirror, while considered part of many Beauty and the Beast stories, is present in Snow White. These are just a couple of examples of the shared themes.

Beauty and the Beast - Cocteau vs. De Beaumont

The primary difference I saw between  the de Beaumont version of the story and the film version by Cocteau was the existence of the arrogant suitor, Avenant.  In the text version, he does not exist, whereas in the film he is created as a rival for the relationship between Belle/Beauty and the Beast.  I saw the existence of this character as more of a testament to the change in format than anything else.  Film plotlines, even early films, are generally much more streamlined than their textual counterparts.  Avenant encapsulates the idea of a marriage for all the wrong reasons--appearance, wealth, status, etc.  In the book version, this idea is illustrated by the cruel sisters, who serve as foils to Belle's virtuous nature.  However, though the awfulness of the sisters is evident in the story, imposing these ideas in the form of an active antagonist heightens the dramatic tension in the film.  With these traits rolled into a character, the central conflict for Belle is much more evident; the decision she has to make is much clearer.

It is also notable that at the end of the transformation scene in the film, the handsome prince has the chiseled features of Avenant but not his boorish behavior.  It could be said that the two mean, rivals for Belle's hand, represent two sides of the same coin--the question of what constitutes a happy marriage.

Cocteau vs. de Beaumont

One difference I noticed between the Cocteau film and de Beaumont's version of Beauty and the Beast was the part of the story where Beauty/Belle goes to take her father's place at the Beast's castle.
In the de Beaumont's version, Belle pleads with her father and brothers to let her go to die instead of her father, and ultimately her father and brothers give in. Even though Belle's father is pretty upset at having to leave her to die in his stead, in the end he leaves her to the mercy of the Beast. However, in Cocteau's version, Beauty mentions that she wants to go to the Beast's castle in place of her father, but before any course of action is decided, the father falls ill and the next day Beauty sneaks out of the house to go to the Beast's castle without her father and brother knowing.

Though this is a relatively minor difference, I still believe it is significant. De Beaumont's version has reader questioning the love Beauty's father has for his daughter - as discussed in class, how can the father just hand over his (favorite) daughter to a Beast? But Cocteau eliminates this predicament altogether. By tweaking the story so that Belle sneaks out without her father knowing, viewers can't really blame the father for being unloving or selfish - Beauty's decision to go to the Beast's castle was out of his hands. Cocteau enables the father to maintain a reputation of being the ultimate loving and caring father - something that is easier for a viewer to understand than a father who allows his own daughter to die in his place.

Beauty and the Beast Ending

The ending having to do with the sisters in the movie and de beaumont's version of Beauty and the Beast were different.  The sisters, in both, were such a taunting, crucial part of the tale.  They treated Beauty horribly out of jealousy and spite.  In the ending of debeaumont's they got their "just desserts".  The fairy turned them into statues to sit outside the Beast and Beauty's palace, and could only be turned back once they got over their evil, jealous minds.  For the movie, they weren't even mentioned at the end.  I found that odd because they were such a big part of the story in general.  It just doesn't transfer.  Including the sisters in the ending adds more to the plot, and gives it more of a conclusion, since they were such a part of the story.  

I just wanted to also mention that altogether, this is very different than the version of Beauty and the Beast which I grew up with.  Belle (Beauty) was an only child, and there were no mention of sisters of any kind.  It was definitely a different view reading the stories in which the Disney movie originated from.  

Assignment 6 - 10.March 2009

Hi Nikki, Erin, Benton, Tiffany, Emily and Michelle,

Here is your assignment for this week, with deadlines different from the usual.

Pick one scene or element from Cocteau's Beauty and the Beast, and compare it or contrast it with de Beaumont's version. You might pick something that interests you, that seems odd, or something that you missed in one version or the other, for example.

For those of you who didn't manage to, you have time to complete the reading and watch the film, which is available on OAK and also on Reserve in the Library.

Deadline for putting up your responses is 09.00 p.m. on Wednesday.

Deadline for comment on at least one post is 10.00 a.m. on Thursday.

Ann

Forgot the Link... sorry!

http://www.surlalunefairytales.com/cinderella/other.html#BURNTFACE

Little Burnt Face

This is a Native American tale from the Micmac tribe. This tale has many components of a catskin tale as well as a few from a Cinderella tale. Like the Cinderella tales, the sisters were mean to the girl and in this case burned her so that she was no longer pretty. They also tried to keep her from the Great Chief. As in the Catskin tales, she wore a birch suit and when she completed the challenge (seeing the Great Chief) the scars vanished and she had nice clothes. This story had typical features that recurred in many stories such as a challenge to face.

Baba Yaga

This story intrigued me because it was so different from other Cinderellas. There were no sisters, no prince, no kingdom even, just a family. After reading it I had to question why it was even included in the Cinderella category as it was so dissimilar from many of the other ones. The evil stepmother was the one thing that gave the story a connection to any of the other tales. Baba Yaga's character was also very strange, the idea that this woman sat here and trained her magical minions for ensnaring girls or something was weird to me. However, the story itself does mirror the Cinderellas in its triumph over the evil thanks to the magical helper being related to the main character, or, the "Fairy Godmother," here the good aunt. The helper advises the protagonist who, using that help, can defeat evil and return to her happy life. So while initially it seems to have little to do with the popular versions of Cindarella, it is pretty similar in its core elements.

http://www.pitt.edu/~dash/type0510a.html#babayaga

Katie Woodencloak

Katie Woodencloak is the Norwegian version of Cinderella.  It has aspects that are both similar and different than the versions of Cinderella that we have read.  The similar aspects deal with the number three- there are three dresses for church, and three woods that she has to pass through with the dun bull.  Another similar aspect is the cloak that she dons in order to disguise herself to keep from being found.  The difference of the versions is that in this case, the prince wont even fathom her with responses.  In the other stories I read, he is at least amused by her, or acknowledges her.  Another difference is that the King is still alive- he is just away, which allows the stepmother to abuse her.  

I picked this story to read, because I figured it would be interesting.  I enjoyed the different take on the Cinderella stories, than the normal glass slipper version that I am so used to due to popular culture.  I had never heard these alternative tales, and wanted to look more into it.  

Assignment 5- 24.Feb 2009

Hi Nikki, Erin, Benton, Tiffany, Emily and Michelle,

Here is your assignment for this week.

Look through the websites suggested below and find a version of Cinderella or even an illustration of her, that has not been talked about in class as yet.

1. D. L. Ashliman's folktale site:
http://www.pitt.edu/~dash/type0510a.html

2. the Sur La Lune fairy tale site:
http://www.surlalunefairytales.com/

3. the Cinderella Project at the Univ. of Mississippi:
http://www.usm.edu/english/fairytales/cinderella/cinderella.html

Having selected the story/illustration, you are to elaborate on the reason you picked that particular story/illustration.

You could talk about how the story is different from what you have read so far and how these differences could be interesting in the light of our current discussions in class.

If you have selected an illustration, mention what about it grabbed you, what about it is different from other illustrations known to you and whether it contradicts or proves any of what we have discussed in class so far.

Posts are to be sent in by Midnight on Tuesday and comments to a minimum of two other posts are to be in by Midnight on Wednesday.

Breaking the Disney Spell

In his essay "Breaking the Disney Spell," Jack Zipes articulates a feeling likely experienced in part by anyone who has grown up watching Disney films and then grown up to give more thought to what they were all about, exactly.  However, it was hard to read this essay and definitively take one side or another--and perhaps ill-advised to do so.  Jack Zipes in a renowned scholar of literary fairy tales, whose work is informed by extensive research into the storytelling tradition behind the stories we have all heard as children.  Walt Disney built a media empire on a very specific interpretation of these well-known stories.  Both have a vested interest in maintaining one extreme or the other, but as a reader, it's hard not to consider your own history and relationship to these stories that are uniquely personal.  

I guess what I'm trying to say is that while I agree with Zipes on a lot of the points he makes, at other times I wanted to tell the man to take several deep breaths and think about dolphins or something equally calming.  

It isn't that I don't agree with Zipes that the Disney version of Snow White takes a number of artistic liberties with the original tale--but so did the 1916 version that we watched, and Zipes does not seem to have a problem with that, perhaps because that version was not part of a cultural phenomenon on the level that Disney's films were.  I do agree that the Disney version of Snow White is vastly different, in tone especially, from the Grimm original.  And I also agree that Snow White, and a number of Disney's other fairy tale films, perpetuate an idea of a patriarchal, male-driven structure (I really wish this most recent Disney Princess craze would end and soon, for all our sakes.)  I find all of those points to be relevant, it's just that I don't think one interpretation of a story with such a rich history behind it is going to ruin or change that story forever.  The very nature of fairy tales is to be passed from person to person and reinterpreted, so how, in essence, is a movie any different from that idea?

That being said, it doesn't mean that I particularly like Disney's interpretation of the Snow White character.  I actually caught myself rooting for the Evil Queen a couple of times, because Snow White was just so annoying.  

Disney

I believe that the main point of this essay was to show how Disney commercialized fairy tales through his films and how this "'violated' the literary genre of the fairy tale" (352).

In class, Professor Figal told us to pick an issue or topic in the Zipes essay to "grapple with." An issue I had with this essay was that Zipes seemed to accuse Disney of sacrificing the old oral and literary traditions of fairy tales for the sake of appealing to his consumers and gaining fame and fortune. I feel that the beauty of fairy tales is how they are able to change and morph depending on who tells them, who is listening, and the circumstances and culture under which these fairy tales get passed along. Disney being a household name that we all associate with fairy tales is something that should be admired, not condemned. Maybe Disney was ultimately in it to make money and gain recognition, but in the end, our culture today is defined by these Disney films, and I just see Disney as another method of passing along fairy tales to the next generation.

Zipes

dentify the thesis/the argument(s) in Jack Zipes' essay , Breaking the Disney Spell’. Do you agree or disagree with him? Justify the stance you take.

While the essay was well written, I found it difficult to take apart one thesis or argument in Zipes essay, "Breaking the Disney Spell".
I found the main argument to be that Disney was taking the classic fairy tales, and minimizing the lessons, replacing them with menial tales that were written and created to make money, and to show and demonstrate his skills as the owner of a company, and an animator.
I partially agree with what Zipes is saying. I do believe, since as he states that Disney was one of the first to use techniques in his animations and films, that Disney wasn't in the business to preserve and demonstrate classic tales. Disney adds too many commercial aspects into his films and stories to really care about the integrity of the stories themselves.

Assignment 4- 3.Feb 2009

Hey Nikki, Erin, Benton, Michelle, Tiffany and Emily,

Below is your assignment:

Identify the thesis/the argument(s) in Jack Zipes' essay , Breaking the Disney Spell’. Do you agree or disagree with him? Justify the stance you take.

• Posts to be sent in by Midnight on Tuesday
• Comments on two other posts to be posted by Midnight on Wednesday

Looking forward to what you have to say.

Ann

Good Going!!

Hi there!
Great to have all your posts in...Looking forward to your views on what you fellow bloggers had to say.
Ann

Roald Dahl's Retelling of Red Riding Hood

In analyzing Dahl's interpretation of Little Red Riding Hood, I could write a long, dry treatise on how it is informed by the (troubling?) climate from whence it came (OMG kids!  And guns!  Kids with guns, OMG!!!)  This kind of argument is logical, but fails to take into account something important about Dahl's work in general: he is a brilliant satirist, and his collection of Revolting Rhymes is no exception.

The thing about Dahl's work that makes it so appealing for me is that he recognizes that children are not oblivious to the message that the world is neither a safe nor forgiving place--ironically, a message driven home in the original versions of the very stories he satirizes in Revolting Rhymes.  He recognizes this, but is never patronizing.  Instead, he approaches warty realities in a way that should be applicable at any stage in life--with a certain degree of realism, but most importantly, with a cool head and a sense of humor.  

In a sense, Dahl is responding to the way he most likely heard the stories told growing up--with the moral "OBEY YOUR PARENTS OR ELSE!!!" and certainly with the notion that the child protagonist can do nothing to save herself and is at the mercy of the adults in her life.  Similar to the way his other stories feature independent children taking matters into their own hands, Dahl's Red Riding Hood isn't about to take any of the Wolf's nonsense about making her his next meal, and promptly takes him out.  

Dahl

Roald Dahl's version of "Little Red Riding Hood and the Wolf" was published originally in 1982 in "Revolting Rhymes."

Based on this information and on Shavit's Method, it is easier to tell that the intended audience for the poem is most likely a teenage/adult contemporary audience. The effectiveness of the humor in the twist is the assumed reader's knowledge of the original version. The plot takes on a humorous twist when the wolf tries to correct Red Riding Hood on the questions she asks. In response to his attempted dinner she whips out a gun and kills him and makes a fur coat out of him.

This contemporary twist of the gun and fur coat as well as the wolf telling Red what she is supposed to say lets the reader know that the intended audience is an older reader who would understand the humor. The title of the book it was published in also illustrates this idea. The main argument for believing he intended the reader to be older is that he is assuming the reader knows the Grimm brothers' wording. One would presumably have gained this knowledge in one's childhood and therefore could understand the humor in an altered version later in life.

Dahl

Roald Dahl’s story were characterized by their unexpected endings, lack of sentimentality, and dark humour.

Having fought in World War II, Roald Dahl was obviously exposed to a lot of gruesomeness and death. Therefore, his poetry can come off with a lot of dark humour, because humour is a means of making light of something sinister. After being in the war, he probably believed that people needed to not take everything so seriously. I was surprised though, that in the poem, he made the joke of Little Red Riding Hood pulling out a pistol. I was surprised by the violence on the part of a female character.

It seems as if the audience was for both adults and children. Children in the sense that it is pedagogical, and adults in the sense that there is a lot of black humour. Dahl did seek to educate and discipline his children readers, the research says, but he also wrote for adults. Perhaps he made the poem so lighthearted because he wanted to preserve some of children’s naiveity and innocence, after getting much of his innocence and naivety destroyed in the war. Despite the dark humour, it seems as though the tale was meant to preserve some purity in children. The elements of sarcasm are meant for adults, though, such as the dialogue. According to the research, “children love his poems and stories because he writes from their point of view, and, in his books adults are often the villains or are just plain stupid.”

The children characters were often made gluttonous, like Augustus Gloop in “Charlie and the Chocolate Factory.” They often have a serious lesson to learn, or punishment to suffer.
January 27, 2009 6:45 PM

Roald Dahl LRRH

Roald Dahl
Dahl's version of Little Red Riding Hood, "Little Red Riding Hood and the Wolf" was written as a compilation of short stories in 1995. There are a few Roald Dahl poem versions of fairy tales included in this book, "Revolting Rhymes"

audience: I believe the audience for this particular version of Little Red Riding Hood would be older children, many of whom have already read and loved Roald Dahl's writing. I would even go as far as to place the parents of these children in the audience as well. Roald Dahl is not only writing to entertain the children, but also the parents. Many of his books are like this.

culture & time: This represents a new culture and time, without many morals and limitations. Roald Dahl's violence and independence of Little Red Riding Hood show a different interpretation on what goes on in today's world (I am considering 1995 close enough to today's world to consider both the same). Reading this version did not phase me the way that it might have phased people years ago. The only moral in this story is to watch out for wolfs, but it doesn't really go into the sexual content. It also shows the little girl as independant and capable of taking care of herself, unlike many of the previous versions read. This is a change, but in today's world we do promote more independence and have more gender equality. If a little girl was shown as weak, that would not go over as well. This version also shows how violence is almost accepted as the norm today. It is almost like, "oh, of course Little Red Riding Hood would take out a pistol, shoot the wolf, and then wear him as a coat." Little kids, rather then the previous huntsman, have access to guns, and this is considered a norm. Violent video games and television shows are so common that it isn't even more then a short pause, and an "of course".

Thurber

--> Outline who you think the audience is and what the fairy tale's retelling says about the culture and time in which it is written:

James Thurber was best known for his contribution to "The New Yorker" magazine, whose audience is very much adult. It is clear that his version of Little Red Riding Hood "The Little Girl and the Wolf" was intended for adults as well.

According to Wikipedia, Thurber's fables were often satirical and that the "moral" was really more of a punchline. In his fairy tale "The Little Girl and the Wolf" Thurber very briefly sets up the Grimm/Perrault version of Little Red Riding Hood, with the little girl carrying a basket of food to her grandmother and encountering the wolf in the woods. However, Thurber chooses the point when the little girl sees the wolf at grandma's house to completely take off in a different direction. Thurber comments that "the wolf does not look any more like your grandmother than the Metro-Goldwyn lion looks like Calvin Coolidge." This is where it first becomes obvious that Thurber intended this fairy tale to be enjoyed by adults because children would most definitely not understand this comparison.
Thurber finishes off the story with the little girl shooting the wolf with an automatic - something also not intended for children. At the end, the moral is indeed a punchline that would be enjoyed by the adults reading it.

This fairy tale was written in 1940, right in the middle of World War II. It was a time when people were in need of funny, lighthearted stories like "The Little Girl and the Wolf" in order to take their minds off of the war that was going on. Thurber's comedic tone definitely represents this desire for people at the time to have something that could take their minds off of hard times.

Assignment 3- 27.Jan 2009

Hi Nikki, Erin, Benton, Michelle, Emily and Tiffany,

Below is the assignment, to which you will send in responses by Midnight on Tuesday.

You have read Shavit's essay comparing the Perrault and Grimm versions of'Little Red Riding Hood'. Using Shavit's method, consider one of the other versions you read for this week (Dahl, Calvino, Thurber, Chiang Mi). With a little research (you may use Wikipedia, since this is not a research paper),outline who you think the audience is and what the fairy tale's retelling says about the culture and time in which it is written.

Looking forward to your posts,

Ann

H&G interpretation

So we discussed through email our thoughts on the film.

Hansel and Gretel would be 13 and 11 respectively as given in the question. The movie would focus on their relationship, especially the care-taking nature of Hansel, like Keene demonstrated in The Juniper Tree. The setting would remain an unspecified location with a very medieval looking forest.

Erin brought up the idea of showing sympathy for the parents. We would want to see the parents grapple with the task of trying to feed the family and failing, and we would not want the decision to leave them in the forest be a premeditated one, just like the stepmother in the Juniper Tree and the way she didn't intentionally lead the boy out on to the fjord or whatever to kill him. She got caught up in the moment and caused him to jump (temporary insanity?) but she never intended initially to cause his death. We would like to see a scene where one or both parents leads the kids into the woods, and the children fall asleep. The parent might see them sleeping so peacefully and decides then and there that death would be better than having to live a horrific life of famine, and perhaps blinded by fear and anguish, runs off and leaves them to die in the woods. More realistic, but no less heartbreaking. This would demonstrate the reality of the famines at the time. Sometimes parents felt they had no choice.

We also discussed the idea of the witch not being as "witchy" as the stepmother. To show the bias of the time toward stepmothers. Also it would create an interesting dynamic between the children and the mother that was present in The Juniper Tree.

Hansel and Gretel Thoughts

Since Keene's version of "The Juniper Tree" obviously did not follow the fairy tale "The Juniper Tree" I think that we should include the following scenes:

- Mother and father falling on hard times (scene should be really dry and empty) struggling with putting food on the table - it would be interesting to add a twist by maybe having Hansel and Gretel be greedy at dinnertime by asking for more bread, etc even to the point of taking the parents' food...

- Mother, father, Hansel, Gretel going into the woods, children falling asleep (like Erin said), and parents leaving them

- Instead of having them go back to their house using the pebbles, i think it would be interesting to keep portraying Hansel and Gretel as greedy and have Hansel start dropping breadcrumbs but have him end up eating most of the bread because he is hungry. (this portrays Hansel as selfish - i agree with Nikki that it would be cool to have Hansel be a villain as well as the witch)

- I think Keene would spend less time on the "witch" portion of the story. Maybe we can have the witch struggling for food (because of the famine or whatnot) which puts less blame on her, just like in "The Juniper Tree" where the blame is less on the stepmom and more on Johannes.

These are my suggestions!

H&G Collaborative

I would like to begin by thinking that Keene would portray the witch as a normal woman, who is not necessarily evil, as he does in The Juniper Tree.  I feel Hansel and Gretel's mother herself would be the more "witchy" of the two.  As for time and place, I feel that once again it would be very undefined.  Although we would hear of the famine, there would be no other characters around, and no trace of other humanity except for those who are the main part of the story.  The landscape would be bare, and desolate looking.  Additionally, based on what we have seen of Keene, Hansel and Gretel may be portrayed as the villian as well as the innocent, depending on the portion of the movie taking place. 

Assignment 2- 20.Jan 2009

Hi Nikki, Erin, Benton, Michelle, Tiffany and Emily,

Below is a copy of the Assignment that was discussed in class today.


The first thing about this assignment that differentiates it from last week's, is the fact that it is going to be TEAMWORK!

Given that you have watched ,,The Juniper Tree'' and attended today's discussion of what this movie portrays, try to, as a group, come up with what Keene's version of ,,Hansel and Gretel", would be. In what sort of a world could this story have been written?

We could assume that the kids are 11 and 13 and the witch is ,,a lone woman'' who lives in a hut in the forest.

Looking forward to all your version of ,,Hansel and Gretel"!

Ann

First response

I found Darnton's essay to be more successful in illuminating fairy tales as not just for children. The combination of Freudian analysis on Little Red Riding Hood as well as a broader examination of the oral tradition as it existed in Europe at the time this story began to circulate made me think of fairy tales the way I think about other, more literary fiction--organic, dynamic pieces that spring from conditions and circumstances affecting real people. In the same way that certain kinds of foods are used in recipes because they tend to absorb flavors in a particular fashion, fairy tales are a reflection of the time, place, and mindset of the storyteller. A retelling of Cinderella will be vastly different, depending on who is telling the story. Darnton takes this idea and examines it in clinical, analytical detail, to great effect.

Sorry this is so late, my internet keeps crashing...

Posts in time!

Great to see that most of you have your posts in on time. They make for very interesting reading!

Introduction

Hi, I'm Emily Schweickhardt.

I'm a senior English and Psychology double-major, an an Art History minor.

Bettelheim

The Struggle for Meaning essay convinced me more that fairy tales do go beyond children's entertainment.  Particularly the point that fairy tales teach about the inner problems of human beings, and about solutions to predicaments in society.  In other words, fairy tales do more than provide a moral education: they give children a chance to "understand himself in the complex world with which he must learn to cope."  Fairy tales are clearly more than entertainment if they have the ability to carry messages to the unconscious, preconscious, and conscious minds simultaneously.  The fact that fairy tales can address all sorts of deep and complex problems, such as "narcicisstic disappointments," "oedipal conflicts," :sibling rivalries," and so on, speaks in and of itself.  By providing grounds for resolution, fairy tales enable children to acquire satisfaction with themselves, Bettelheim states.  With such statements, Bettelheim makes it clear that fairy tales are more than entertainment, because they do more than simply arouse curiosity, which entertainment does: they allow the child to find meaning in life, which Bettelheim says is the most important and difficult task to successfully accomplish in the period of childhood.

Response #1

As I see it, the key difference between these two articles has to do with what they perceive their subject matter to be. While reading Bettelheim, it appears that the author is much more concerned with the stories we tell our children and how that relates to their psychological make up. While this may be an interesting topic, it is clear that he really isn't talking about fairy tales at all. He is interested in the popular versions of Red Riding Hood and why this story is better for young children than other stories parents may read, but in this analysis he doesn't really get to the root of what fairy tales are, rather what their modern transformation into children's stories can do for our kids. Darnton, on the other hand, sees this gap in Bettelheim's argument. There's nothing particularly wrong with Bettelheim's analysis of the effects of good stories on children, but the fact is that this argument really doesn't have anything to do with fairy tales at all, just children's stories, many of which may be derived from sources like the Grimms and Mother Goose. In Darnton's article, he focuses more on the anthropological importance and development of fairy tales: who told them, why they are what they are, how they were perceived by the audience, et cetera. This is a much better template to understanding these tales and their unique place in the history of oral and written literature. Darnton sees fairy tales as what they really are and tries to understand them in that light rather than going down Bettelheim's road of placing other meanings on a particularly recent incarnation of these stories. In the end, Darnton's view provides a much richer and more accurate way of seeing fairy tales both within and out of their historical contexts. Fairy tales are evolving, vague, unique, enriching, sometimes unsettling, and thoughtful pieces of history, not merely bedtime stories to keep our kids from growing up crazy.

-Benton Payne

PS-

I'm Benton Payne (first name is Marshall, though I don't go by it)
I'm a Film Studies / History Major and I'm always looking for different ways to perceive the art of storytelling

Response # 1

Many people believe this is where the fairy tale tradition all began. Robert Darnton discusses the long historical tradition of fairy tales that extends centuries before the Brothers Grimm. In the early days of fairy tales, they were used for entertainment for adults. In France, the first collection of stories was printed for the courtiers. The stories were raunchier and there was no need for symbolism it seemed. These older tales were often watched as performances for all ages. They as Darnton says "were meant to amuse adults or to frighten children" (287). In France, the veillee was an institution that allowed men and women to work while tales were performed aloud. The purpose of these older stories was far from being children's entertainment alone. Darnton points out that many recurring themes were that of rape, sodomy, incest, and cannibalism. This seems very different from the stories I heard growing up. This evolution of the stories shows the long history of these tales. The stories were preserved over the centuries because of the cultural significance. Many of the storytellers adapted their versions to fit the people and places with which the audience would be familiar. The long historical tradition that Darnton illustrates is clear evidence that these stories are much more than just children's entertainment. While Bettleheim gives evidence to the fact that these stories are important for the development of children, I felt that Darnton gave a more helpful in seeing fairy tales in a different light rather than for the sole purpose of amusing children.

Response 1- Nikki

I took this question as being asked which essay helped me look beyond fairy tales as childrens' entertainment. For me, this was Robert Dartons' essay entitled "Peasant's Tell Tales: The Meaning of Mother Goose". With this essay, a lot of connotations that different cultures have about fairy tales were brought up, many of them sexual. This was not what I would interpret these fairy tales as at first glance, although I can see where they can make it work in these contexts. I have always thought of fairy tales as picture books and disney movies. This lets me see beyond the ordinary so-called "stereotypes" and "assumptions" I may have towards the genre of fairy tales. From the point of view of this article, these are definitely not just the children's stories that we know and love!

Initially, I thought this question was asking which essay is more helpful in illustrating that fairy tales can be more than children's entertainment - as in fairy tales can be geared towards adults as well. In this sense, Robert Darnton's essay, "Peasants Tell Tales: The Meaning of Mother Goose" was helpful because this essay started off with an 18th century French version of "Little Red Riding Hood." It was very Rated "R"-esque (or maybe PG-13 according to today's standards, who knows...) with all the cutting up bodies, draining blood, cannibalism, and the striptease. I've never heard this version of Little Red Riding Hood, and this version clearly illustrated that some fairy tales were definitely not geared towards children.

Darnton's essay also points out other, earlier versions of fairy tales like "Bluebeard" and "Sleeping Beauty." The subjects of rape, sodomy, incest, and cannibalism is definitely not suitable for children and through this essay, I can definitely see that fairy tales can be much more than children's entertainment.

But after reading Bettelheim's essay, I understood that the blog question for today was not just asking us to look for which essay helped to show that fairy tales could be geared towards adults as well as children, but actually meant for us to see which essay showed that fairy tales were more than children's entertainment - as in fairy tales could be educational/integral to the development of children as well as be entertaining.

Bettelheim definitely made a great point by showing how the content of fairy tales is at the same time entertaining and engaging but also stimulates children's imaginations, illustrate to children potential dilemmas and difficulties they might face in real life, and also help children to have confidence in their ability to face and resolve these difficulties.


So I guess my answer to today's blog question would depend on how you interpret it.
To me, Darnton's essay is more effective than Bettelheim's essay in showing that fairy tales can be geared towards adults as well as children, but Bettelheim's essay is definitely better at illustrating the educational as well as entertainment value that fairy tales have for children.

Assignment 1- 13.Jan 2009

Hi , Erin, Marshall, Michelle, Nikki and Tiffany,


Below you will find the question to which all of you must post one response by Tuesday Midnight.

On Wednesday, there will be four posts to read, since you have four group mates. Read through their responses and comment on at least two of them. You could agree, disagree, pose a related question and try to build on what the other person has said.

By Wednesday Midnight, you will have to have posted the comments, so that I can look through what you have written, and forward interesting posts/comments to Prof. Figal.

THE QUESTION FOR 13.JANUARY 2009:

Which of the following two essays do you find more productive in helping you to think about fairy tales as more than children's entertainment? Why?


Darnton, Robert. “Peasants Tell Tales: The Meaning of Mother Goose,” in Tatar, The Classic Fairy Tales
or
Bettelheim, Bruno. “The Struggle for Meaning,” in Tatar, The Classic Fairy Tales


Looking forward to your responses!

Ann

Introduction

My name is Tiffany Dempsey. I am a sophomore History/Art History major.

Introduction

Nikki Moss

Junior

Early Childhood Education/Child Studies

Children's Lit Fanatic

Introductions - Michelle Kim

Name: Michelle Kim
Year: Senior, 2009

School of Engineering
Major: Engineering Science

I am taking this class because I really do love fairy tales - the Disney versions and the original versions!

This is a random video from Youtube